Monday, November 8, 2010

Pre and Extra - Marital Sex

Oh my. I have been really challenged. Okay warning: If you are embarrassed by hearing someone talk about sex and purity or anything like that...then don't read this post.

I was on my NaNoWriMo forum and engaged in a conversation about pre-marital and extra-marital sex. I was very disturbed that only a very few actually believed in saving your virginity for marriage and fewer than that saw the value of marriage. I was challenged because I realized that I didn't have an established answer on why I was going to wait to have sex. It disturbed me that I hadn't put the thought into it before. i know why, but I wasn't prepared in the slightest to share why with someone else who disagreed in every way. So anyways, after posting back and foward and few times, watching the other people post and then being convicted of the fact that I wasn't really speaking up about the lord...I developed a portion of my reasons. WHY, I'm waiting. And WHY marriage is important.

I was at first just saying, "I believe in abstinence and marriage" but not really backing it up.

I encourage you all to FIND your answers to these questions. We will face this problem for the rest of our lives. In college, with our children, our friends and family, and even within the body of Christ.

Be ready with an answer.

To top off my conviction, I just memorized this verse about two weeks ago. "but sanctify the Lord God in your heart and ALWAYS be READY to give an answer about the hope that is in you, with meekness and fear." 1 Peter 3:15

Thanks God. <_< So I am going to post my post about it here. I would LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE LOVE feedback. What you all think about it, what you think I missed in my post and how you would answer these questions. Now here's some food for thought. These are the questions that were being brought up. Why not if you love them? Why marry? They never last anyways? Why do people stake others value on weather they have had sex or not? Many sexual partners is a good thing. It doesn't have side effects emotionally or physically. Everyone else is doing it. WHy should we wait? Love is love. If you back up sex with actions, what's the problem? HOW WOULD YOU ANSWER? Here's how I did. Tell me what you think. I think there are a few things maybe some of you guys aren't seeing. I'm not going to try to convince you, but just explain my beliefs in a little more detail.

First off, I believe in abstinence because of Jesus Christ in my life. I'm not a catholic, or an episcopalian, or a Mormon and anything. I am a Christian who believes in the Word of God. The Bible tells me to wait for marriage. And I will becasue God loved me enough to die for me - therefore I'm willing to believe and do anything He tells me to do, without questions. He knows best.

Why did God tell me not to have sex? Because He wanted to destroy my fun? NO! He talks about how people desire each other sexually and that it's a good thing. I TRULY HOPE that me and my husband will desire each other soo much and have a GREAT time in bed. That's a thrilling thing to strive after. :)

One thing I think we are missing is the value of marriage. Marriage isn't a useless ceremony. It's a promise. A covenant that we make with a man before our friends family and God. And yes, a lot of marriages don't make it. It's sad. It's not the way it was intended to be. But I think a big reason they don't make it is because people have a twisted definition of love. Love isn't just gushy sexual feelings and desires. Believe it or not, but when you start getting a double chin, and your butt droops no ones gonna really desire you anymore. If we just base love on how we FEEL about people. LOVE WON'T LAST! that's the truth. Or minds cannot handle a love forever, and neither can our bodies. Our own bodies go through hormone changes that could alter our loves for a while.

That to say, marriage is a commitment you make to be with someone forever. For better or worse, for richer or poorer, in sickness and in health...till DEATH DO YOU PART.

"Wait!" you say, "You just told us our bodies couldn't really handle the same love forever." Yep, I did. And that is true IF it's based solely on our feelings. True a choice. We have to decide to love each other. And that's the value of marriage that I think you all might be missing.

Let's put away the whole sex thing right now and just talk about loving people in general. Choosing to love someone in a marriage is putting aside your wants and desires to serve them. TRUE LOVE is thinking of the people around you and caring for their needs before you care for your own.

So, think of a relationship where people were constantly trying to do that. If both people were saying, "You first, than me." Than marriages wouldn't have the problems they do today. Cause every fight is selfishness in both parties.

I am choosing to wait for marriage to have sex because I am dreaming of my future. I am dreaming of the husband I will be with one day. I am considering his feeling above mine. The easy way out would be to have sex for the whoo of it, right? Yes. But I am thinking about the day when my husband and I can learn together how to have sex. I don't have to be a pro to keep him. That's not what he will love about me. I am dreaming of a time when I can be in my husbands arms and not have to remember past relationships and partners.

Abstinence dreams of it's future.

I dream of my future. I dream of true love. I dream of a love unmarred by past experiences.

Second (wow, that was a long first), extra or premarital sex is NOT SAFE. There ARE facts and it is dangerous. Here, I have a brocheur on my dresser.

*runs to get it*

Next to the common cold and flue STDs are the most common disease in America. Wanna know why? Because the guys you just slept with has slept with two other people, who have both slept with two other people who have slept with two other people....ect.

1 in 5 Americans are in infected with an STD.

41,000 people get infected in the US every day. 2/3s of them being in people under the age of 25. O.O

80% of the people infected don't show initial symptoms.

Beware because your partner may lie about the fact that they were involved sexually in the past, they may not know they have an STD (80% don't), teens are more physically susceptible, CONDOMS DON'T PROTECT like you think they do. They help sometimes with pregnancies, but do not stop from transmitting STDs.

Beware, because you can be legally liable for giving someone a STD,

Quote by C. Everett Koop, Former US Surgeon General "when you have sex with someone, you are having sex with everyone they have had sex with for the last ten years, and everyone they and their partners have had sex with for the last ten years. "

Lastly (finally), I want to clear up this whole "purity" thing. Your value is not staked on your virginity. It's not. Period. we all make mistakes. We all do things we shouldn't do, but it doesn't mean that you aren't worth anything anymore. We all have sexual purity, but real purity is a process. It's a journey in our lives. It's about becoming Christlike in our walk and talk. So physically speaking, purity is something you can give away with your virginity, but it doesn't mean it cannot be achieved again.

See, this is the awesome part. If we have had sex (or worse, it was taken from us) God still sees us as someone desperately in need of Him and LOVES US (now, this is the true perfect love). I am in need of a Savior but I haven't had sex or oral sex. I need a Savior because I'm a sinner. I sin all the time. To be honest, I struggle with lust, a lot. I've lied, cheated and hated others. See? I'm not "pure". Physically? Yes. Spiritually? No.

The only REALLY REAL purity is the purity found in Jesus Christ's person. And it is available to each of us. It is available to me, and the only reason I make it from day to day is knowing that Christ is going to help me achieve that purity in the long run if I depend on Him.

My value is found in the God. My value is found in who I am.

I might sound like a loon, but I will choose abstinence because I dream of my future, because it's safe and because i know it pleases my father, God.

I hope that made a little since to you guys. :)


LunaPuma said...

Great blog, Ashley! That couldn't have been a very easy topic to talk about, but I think you've handled it well. I agree with you on all your points. I also believe in waiting until marriage. I used to just think, "Well, it's just the RIGHT thing to do." but then I came to realize that it was more than that; It's what GOD wants us to do. He knows what's best. We just have to trust Him.

I love the fact that my future husband will be my first and only. No one likes(or SHOULD like) "used goods". I plan on doing more than just waiting until marriage for intimacy; I'm waiting until my wedding day to have my first mouth-to-mouth kiss. Even though sometimes it's SO hard to resist the urge to just lay one on my boyfriend, I don't do it. He's the same way, and I'm really thankful for that. It makes sticking with my standards easier. How awesome would it be to share your first ever kiss with your husband, the one you KNOW you love and KNOW loves you back?! Sounds pretty amazing to me.

I just wish more people would think about their actions and the consequences that can come from them.

Thanks for posting this. Keep up the good work! =]

Alice Hu said...

Hi! I'm just a stranger who got here through your thread post and your nano profile :D hope you don't mind me dropping by XD

Alright, I had a nice long post all ready but google was acting up and it didn't send, so I'll try my best to paraphrase.

First off, huge kudos to you for posting this. It takes guts to talk about your faith in a place where anyone can read it, and I admire you for that :)

I read through a few posts on your thread, and I was pretty surprised at what some of them said. "Fun"? I do believe God made us sexual creatures for a reason, but that is no excuse to go indulge in that privilege.

Sex isn't (or rather, shouldn't be) a selfish act. As strange/awkward as it sounds, I do want my first kiss and virginity to be a gift to my future husband, whoever he is. And if God's will is for me to remain single for my whole life, so be it!

Thanks for sharing, Ashley! :D

Ashley said...

@ Alice: YEA! Thanks so much for dropping by. I should friend you on NaNo! :) Come back and keep commenting. I don't get enough comments and it can be discouraging.

And thank you! The Lord doesn't call Christians to be silent.

I agree sex should only be an act of love, not selfishness to get it from who we want when we want.

@both of you: I admire you guys for only wanting to kiss when you're married. unfortunately, it's a little late for me on that one, but I have new resolve to save my next one for the man I marry. Ah, talk about special.

Like I said, real purity is a process, and christ doesn't see our worth through what've we've done but what His Son did. :)

@Luna: AH! I LOVE YOUR ENTHUSIASM! Keep it, becuz as you two get deeper in the relationship it will get harder, trust me. We need people who have that goal. Go him for wanting that too. Sadly, I meet more girls than guys with that mindset. Just remember that we live in a world where people condone it all the time and set out daily to please the Lord. Is touching my BF pleasing to God? No. Remind yourself.


Kirstin said...

Ashley! I agree with everything you said on here! It makes me so happy that you totally stood up for your beliefs in front of a bunch of people!
"To be honest, I struggle with lust, a lot. I've lied, cheated and hated others. See? I'm not "pure". Physically? Yes. Spiritually? No." Reading that was like I wrote it myself. I'm the same way.

And I also agree with Amanda (Luna) about the waiting until my wedding day for my first kiss. I don't know if i'll make it that far but if I do, it's such a great thought to think that the first person I kiss will be the man I get to spend the rest of my life with! Plus, on the upside, I won't necessarily know if he's a bad kisser because I'll have nobody to compare him to! Haha!
Anyways, great blog post, Ashy! :)

Hope said...

Ashley!! Thank you so much for having the courage to openly talk about this!! I was so excited to see it!!! It really meant a lot to me, because I've struggled not only in my mind with this issue..but physically too. No, I haven't lost my purity, but I've struggled with masterbation..I awakened a part of my life that shouldn't have been touched.. Yes, I'm ashamed to admit it, but God has been, and always will be there for me!
He took away that burden, the guilt and shame! I know He loves me! I know He still wants me!!! =) thank you Ashley, for addressing this issue! I love you terribly!!! Hopie <3

Ashley said...

@Kirstin: Thanks for the comments, and for being honest. I know that I have struggled with lust and I've decided to be transparent about the matter because I think more people than we realize struggle with it. It's been awesome because there is help in Jesus Christ. And boy, what a freeing thing it is.

Yeah, it will be awesome. I'm cheering you on! You go girl!! Keep that endeavor and don't let ANYONE persuade you!

@Hope: Girl, I love you so much! You are incredibly precious. Thanks for being so open about yourself. I think God will reward stuff like that. Me too. I've struggled their too. It's SUCH a battle, I know. But like you said, there is healing in Christ. I'm still trying to get past that one. I think I'm going to actually write a post about that stuff. I might not have anymore friends, but hey, if it speaks to one'll be worth it.


Anonymous said...

testing if I am getting thru ck

Anonymous said...

I pretty much agree with everything you, and everyone else said! 'Nuff said...=D

Anonymous said...

Ashley, once again "what a power house you are! Openness and honesty abound from your blog.
Sexual feelings are as much a part of our human DNA as the air we breath. What a gift!

Why this story comes to mind --- from Papa Charlie--
1958 high school senior Tom stole freshman Cindy away from her boy freind and convinced her to have sex. Cindy was impressionabley IN LOVE. " A senior want'g to take me, a freshman, out as a girl friend! Tom was a scumbag bragging how easy she was and having unprotected sex at that..they soon became the talk of the school, Cindy's innocence no longer her secret. I do not think Cindy had a clue that everyone knew. Tom moved on after high school -- Cindy stayed in town and later married the boy she'd jilted to be with Tom. Most of us boys lost respect, if we had any, for Tom. Most of us felt sorry for Cindy but many other boys now tried to date her.
50 plus years later - I recently saw a picture of Cindy in our home town newspaper on the Internet, now a full blow mature woman. Blast - unintentionally my thoughts went back to that high school scene. At our 50th class reunion Tom showed up and after all these years was still making slimey cracks about going out after the reunion party to pick up Cindy for his fun. Of course he was all talk.
Proud of your thinking Ashley especially not being afraid to ask questions. Life can be good. love you gal papa ck

Anonymous said...


First I have to say something to a certain commenter.

"No one likes(or SHOULD like) "used goods"".

Get that attitude out of here. That's not okay, and that's not how it works -- it's not like you're marked with a big ol' blinking sign once you kiss someone once, or have sex.


Your stats are bad, as shown to you on the thread. Your beliefs -- fine, okay, believe what you like, but don't spread misinformation.

Also, I am not pleased that the thread was just you trawling for opinions. Looks like you got bit, sister.

Ashley said...


Well, I'm a little confused on what you were trying to say to me. :) Uh, I was trawling for opinions. I'm sorry if it seems different. I use this blog to encourage my friends and family to stick up for what they believe in. And that's why I posted my comment here. I wasn't trying to get attention or anything like that so please don't misread my intentions.

I simply found it convicting that In didn't have the answers and explanations that I should have had and am encouraging my friends to find what they believe and know. That's all. 8)

Thanks for visiting my blog. Come back! I haven't been posting very much because NaNo ate my life, but I do normally. :)

Alexis said...

Thank you for this challenge! As a sister in Christ I struggle with some of the same things that you do, but I've never really had any answers to the world's questions. Now is the time to step up and show them what we are made of; we have an example to set: I do, you do, the body of Christ does. And it starts here.
Thanks for posting!!!!! =^}

Lexi Winters (or Annie!)

Emily Ann Kidd said...

Hey Ashley,

This is a really awesome post (; I love it. I am a part of a website called Dancing with Jesus, and we need more staff members to write and support this ministry.
you can fill out an application at and click the apply tab, or email me at with dwj in the subject line (:
I hope to hear from you soon.


Felipe Gama said...
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Felipe Gama said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Felipe Gama said...

This is a part from this post:

"Marriage isn't a useless ceremony. It's a promise. [...] If we just base love on how we FEEL about people. LOVE WON'T LAST! that's the truth. Or minds cannot handle a love forever, and neither can our bodies. [...]

That to say, marriage is a commitment you make to be with someone forever. For better or worse, for richer or poorer, in sickness and in health...till DEATH DO YOU PART.

"Wait!" you say, "You just told us our bodies couldn't really handle the same love forever." Yep, I did. And that is true IF it's based solely on our feelings. True a choice. We have to decide to love each other. [...]

Choosing to love someone in a marriage is putting aside your wants and desires to serve them. TRUE LOVE is thinking of the people around you and caring for their needs before you care for your own."

I noticed that part mostly because it highlights something I believe in.

Love, and specially marriage, is a commitmment, a promise that you make to stay with this person because of the feelings you two share, even when faced with difficulties, as is made clear by the vows.

I don't get too hardcore about it though, no one should be forced to live miserably, but I believe the option to ignore the vows and get divorced has made people forget what those vaw were for to begin with, and abuse this "escape route".

People marry expecting to be happy 100% of the time, that there will be no fights, no issues, that neither them nor their partners will ever do anything wrong, that they won't have troubled times, that there won't be times that their love may die down a little.

But all of those things are part of a long-term relationship as the one marriage is supposed to be, there will be good times and bad times.

And that's what the vows are for, it's a promise that we will endure thesee hard times, and get past them into the next good ones. It's a sacrifice in the name of the love we feel for our partner. If one doesn't even TRY to live through these difficulties, if they simply give up in the first chance like that, there is no point in getting married to begin with.

Now, with that said (sorry, that was much longer than I expected, it's much harder to explain these stuff than I thought it was), I have this quote from another of your posts:

"A woman. Is flawlessly faithful with her husband. Perfect. Is everything a man could ask for, works hard, beautiful, submits to him and loves him unconditionally. But tragically, she finds out that her husband has been unfaithful. She is heart-broken. Naturally."

I know that the reason why you wrote this was a different one, but it did make me curious about something.

Considering the situation described here, of this perfect wife being cheated by her husband, and your (apparent) belief in working hard to make marriages work instead of giving up on them, what do you think would be the right course of action for the woman to take?

I have my answer, I believe THAT would be a reason for divorce.

Actually, it kind of amuzes me that people get divorced because they can't agree on a TV channel to watch at night, but at the same time, plenty of couples stay together after cases of cheating. That's some twisted priorities.

Anyway, I do see reasonable arguments for both answers. I also agree that staying married even after that would indeed be the moral high road to take, it's all about forgiveness after all. But that road is just too high for me, this is maybe the only one thing that I would never be able to accept, no matter the circumstances.

Well, if you read this, I'd be curious to know your answer too, and which arguments were most important to make up your mind. I find this to be an interesting point of discussion.

See ya.

PS: 3rd try, I believe the text is clear all the way through this time!

Ashley said...

Okay, first of all, I think it's important for you to understand that everything I post on this blog is centered around the Bible and what Jesus Christ demands of His followers. So, if my ideas are extreme it's because they come from our perfect example, Jesus.

And yes, I'm happy for debate. In fact, debate often shapes our thinking - which I'm for.

I do believe there are reasons for divorce. The Bible permits divorce for three reasons: unfaithfulness, abuse and the unbelieving spouse leaving. Of course, these situations are not always black and white so they have to be handled on a case by case basis. I do not think it is right for a woman to stay with her husband if he hits and rapes her. If unfaithfulness occurs, it is Biblicaly legal for divorce, but I think couples should try to work it out. Not sure if I could...that would be very hard. But, my God works miracles and changes hearts and that is all one could pray for in the case of unfaithfulness.

And if there is unfaithfulness, its not the type of things we can just apologize for and move on...the heart of the action has to be dealt with; that takes time and may never really be healed.

There will be good times and bad times. You're right. People have just reduced love to an "attraction" which is the problem. One day, you are going to stop being attractive and the person who married you is going to have to CHOOSE to love you. And that's the point. LOVE is a CHOICE not a FEELING. Feelings will never ever last forever.

I hope this was understandable.

Felipe Gama said...

I do not believe your ideas to be extreme.

Well, maybe they are extreme when you look at them out of context, but that's not the case here. As you said, you base your views on Biblical teachings, some may disagree with it, which is completely fair, but it would be extremely wrong to heavily criticize or offend you because of that; you are not just someone repeating religious mantras that you don't even understand as some people are.

You interpret the scriptures, analize them and give your reasons and view on what they mean and why you believe that's what they mean, using that as a basis for your defence of it.

As I said, one may not believe the Bible to be holy, that's one's right. But you give solid arguments for all of the beliefs you defend here, your defence of them is based not only in the fact that they are in the Bible, but specially on those very arguments.

Dismissing your points just because they are based on the Bible, without even given consideration into the solid thinking you've put into it, would be just an extremist and hate-induced action. And we all know that nothing good comes from hate.

One's spiritual beliefs must never act as an excuse for hateful behaviour. I hope that one day everyone will be able to understand that, be they Christians, Muslins, Atheist or whatever else. Thankfully, we have good people on all of these groups as well, people like you who are the key for mutual understanding and respect.

And yeah, debate is great, I'm happy you are up to it, as I believe that as long as the people debating have a pure mind and a good heart, most of the time an agreement will be found, and if not, at the very least we will get mutual understanding and respect for the other's opinion.


Felipe Gama said...

Now to the matter at hand:

I was not aware of the bible allowing for divorce in this case, so it is refreshing to learn of this fact.

And it seems like your view on cases of unfaithfulness is similar to mine. I'd LIKE to say I'd be able to forgive it, but I don't think I could, as I take fidelity very seriously.

I guess we'd have to analize the marriage as a whole then. First, one is to assume that we should not marry a person who we believe may become unfaithful in the future. So, in the case of it happening, it would mean that we probably didn't know the person as well as we thought we did.

And that's quite important, the whole point of a relationship that develops the "proper way" is that we get to actually know that person completely.

We are not marrying for the looks, as those will fade away. We also can't simply marry someone for their qualities, be them personal, spiritual or any other kind, because that is just one side of the coin. In a really loving and true relationship we should know our partner throughouly, the good things about them that makes us admire them, but also the bad things about them, which reduce their worth in our eyes.

Only by knowing all of that can we truly judge if this person, with it's qualities and faults, is someone who we can commit to love and care for forever.

After all, in tough times, the person's qualities may become almost absent, while their faults become more apparent, those will probably be miserable times for the couple, but it's here that truly knowing the person you marry is important.

You can remind yourself WHY you married that person to begin with, you know that their qualities outweigh their issues in your mind, that's why you CHOSE to marry them. Knowing both this and the fact that this was likely to happen in a life-long partnership, you will be stronger than ever in your commitment to make this person happy, giving them all of your support to help them overcome whatever it is that's causing these issues.

This is what true love is all about, caring enough that you will suffer to help your loved one. It's easy to love at happy times when everything is fine.

Now, with that said, how would all of this apply to unfaithfulness?

First thing is, was it a one-time thing or is it an usual act on their part? If it's a recurring issue, then it was a wrong choice, simple as that, I can't think of why would anyone commit to a relationship in which the other person does not feel the same way.

Now if it was an one-time-only thing, it gets more complex.

Try to imagine the pain of being cheated by someone who you loved with all your heart, and who loved you back the same way, someone who you've made a choice to love for all of eternity, a choice you never had a doubt about.

I can't really know how that would feel, I can only imagine it, and I don't think myself to be capable of imagining something as complex as that.

I guess that we could never truthfully answer this question unless I experienced the feeling myself.

For now, based on my highly unreliable imagination, I'm quite confident that I wouldn't be able to handle it, but I can't be 100% sure, nt without it happening to me, and I hope it never does.

Well, sorry for the long post. I seemingly do not have the capacity to write about complex issues in reasonable amounts of words. So I hope you can bear with me and read this far into this wall of text lol.

Have a nice day.

PS: I mentioned in another post about a huge comment of mine that did not go through, I understand now, there's a limit of 4000 and something words which forced me to break this comment into two sections (or maybe 3, we will see). Considering the other post was at least 3 times the combined size of all these posts here, it was likely some 15000 words lol. That is almost a book.